There is a back and forth each time I get a phone call requesting a quote. I'm sure it is frustrating on both sides of the line.
"How much to put a belt on my car?" asks the caller, innocently enough.
All the burden now is on me. I have to find out how to best take care of this caller's problem and I'll need a lot more information. I need to know what kind of "car", year, make, model, engine, accessories, systems, etc. So to get started,
"What kind of car is this?" ask I.
I have to tell you, a LOT of people get stuck right there. They may be somewhere in the neighborhood on the year and make, less sure on the model and rarely know the trim package. Engine size is usually not exact but most know 4, 6 or 8. It can be complicated though even if you know it is 5.3. There are more than one version of 5.3 and there is Flex or Gas, etc. Sometimes we are left with the caller digging around for the title to get the 8th digit of the vin, or the full vin. Which brings me to the point of this post.
A license plate is often the easiest way to get the needed car information. Texas tag LRD2276 comes back as vin 2T1BURHEXGC489086. The vin is for a 2016 Toyota Corolla L, 4cyl 1.8 U MFI DOHC. One of the snags searching this car with no vin is that there are two 1.8 vin U engine versions, 2ZR-FAE and 2ZR-FE. The vin method and we find this is the 2ZR-FE 1.8 engine. There is more. 6sp manual trans. Vehicle produced in Ontario Canada. 13.2 gal fuel tank. 106.3 in wheelbase. 3820 GVWR. A/C, Power Brakes, All Wheel ABS, 4dr Sedan, etc.
With a vin we can even check for recalls at nhtsa.gov. Indeed there actually is one unrepaired recall on this car.
We can also now pull up repair and estimate information that applies specifically to the car in question with no guesswork about whether it is relevant or not.
Now I can get back to the original question and address it more knowledgeably. There is no timing belt as it uses a timing chain. There is only one drive belt. Now I don't have to ask which belt. I do have to ask if there is a problem related to the belt or if the belt is being replaced as regular maintenance. If the belt snapped or fell off there are likely to be other problems that need inspected. There are two available belts, one for Japan built and one for built elsewhere. We know this was built in Canada.
Now we have an accurate estimate. Or, at least as accurate as possible prior to inspecting the car myself.
Thanks for reading!
Kenny@ggauto.repair
Friday, March 13, 2020
Monday, February 24, 2020
Car Checks
I am a firm believer that if you are considering a car purchase you should make sure that particular car is inspected for obvious problems. Researching a make or model to find they are all well made and highly rated doesn't mean the particular one you are looking at isn't completely trashed. That being said, do your research then have the car inspected.
In the shop I like to use the vin for a few things before doing the physical inspection. Now why would I use a vin (vehicle identification number) to look at general information? The vin gives you information about the particular model and engine combination you are looking at. Lets do a walk-thru:
1FTRW07642KB34176 becomes a 2002 Ford F150 Lariat, 4.6 SuperCrew
It has one unrepaired recall (always check the manufacturer for full recall info) involving fuel tank straps corroding.
A Reliability Report is about these trucks in general. No significant problems. Moderate problems with engine, steering/suspension, brake and accessories.
You know you run searches for information online sometimes? Professional mechanics/technicians do too. Top 5 searches for this model (identifix):
1. P0171
2. Firing Order
3. High Idle
4. P0316
5. Instrument Cluster Programming
(shopkeypro)
1. Firing Order
2. Fuse/Relay/Junction Boxes
3. Fuse Box
4. Fuel Pressure
5. Fuel Pump
After gathering the more general things it's time to look at specifics with a full system scan of this particular truck. A system scan on this Ford is better run on the OTC Encore because I want a print out for the customer. Sometimes a different scan tool is better, sometimes not. The Autel MX808 also does a good job with a print out here.
After the scans and a sort of overview of anything that appears in the scans it is time for the physical inspection. I look for signs of obvious problems, inspect brakes, drivetrain, tires, leaks, belts, hoses, lighting, steering, suspension and eyeball for signs of neglected maintenance, etc. You don't want to buy a car just in time to replace the timing belt or the spark plugs due to mileage so noticing mileage vs maintenance is important.
The test drive comes next, assuming it is safe to drive. Notice the wheel alignment, the steering, the ride, the handling, the performance and the braking. Notice the a/c gets cold, the heater hot and it blows at the correct vents. I let the customer do anything else themselves, like seat belts or radio or interior lights, etc. I just try to look that the vehicle is in good condition to drive and relay the findings to the customer.
Thanks
kenny@ggauto.repair
In the shop I like to use the vin for a few things before doing the physical inspection. Now why would I use a vin (vehicle identification number) to look at general information? The vin gives you information about the particular model and engine combination you are looking at. Lets do a walk-thru:
1FTRW07642KB34176 becomes a 2002 Ford F150 Lariat, 4.6 SuperCrew
It has one unrepaired recall (always check the manufacturer for full recall info) involving fuel tank straps corroding.
A Reliability Report is about these trucks in general. No significant problems. Moderate problems with engine, steering/suspension, brake and accessories.
You know you run searches for information online sometimes? Professional mechanics/technicians do too. Top 5 searches for this model (identifix):
1. P0171
2. Firing Order
3. High Idle
4. P0316
5. Instrument Cluster Programming
(shopkeypro)
1. Firing Order
2. Fuse/Relay/Junction Boxes
3. Fuse Box
4. Fuel Pressure
5. Fuel Pump
After gathering the more general things it's time to look at specifics with a full system scan of this particular truck. A system scan on this Ford is better run on the OTC Encore because I want a print out for the customer. Sometimes a different scan tool is better, sometimes not. The Autel MX808 also does a good job with a print out here.
After the scans and a sort of overview of anything that appears in the scans it is time for the physical inspection. I look for signs of obvious problems, inspect brakes, drivetrain, tires, leaks, belts, hoses, lighting, steering, suspension and eyeball for signs of neglected maintenance, etc. You don't want to buy a car just in time to replace the timing belt or the spark plugs due to mileage so noticing mileage vs maintenance is important.
The test drive comes next, assuming it is safe to drive. Notice the wheel alignment, the steering, the ride, the handling, the performance and the braking. Notice the a/c gets cold, the heater hot and it blows at the correct vents. I let the customer do anything else themselves, like seat belts or radio or interior lights, etc. I just try to look that the vehicle is in good condition to drive and relay the findings to the customer.
Thanks
kenny@ggauto.repair
Tuesday, February 18, 2020
When Your Car Won't Start (2005 Impala)
There are definite differences to how a car owner sees a no-start versus how a professional mechanic sees it. One thing is that if your car won't start you will try to make it start. There is no good time for your car to not start. You were on your way somewhere and your car was needed to take you there. If trying a dozen times while crossing your fingers might work, you'll try it.
A mechanic, on the other hand, isn't necessarily trying to start your car. He's trying to see why it won't start. There is a difference. There are a lot of reasons for a car to not start and there are a lot of different cars. Lets walk through this particular no-start on a 2005 Impala.
No-start has to get broken down into smaller possibilities. Does the engine crank? Cranking is the starter engaging and spinning the engine. If it cranks well, spins over well then your no-start isn't a battery, alternator or starter issue and you can forget about looking for jumper cables.
I noticed there was no check engine (MIL) light on with the key on. There should be at least a bulb check. I connected a scan tool mainly to see if the engine computer was working. The computer was communicating, several codes were stored but none seemed directly related to the no-start. There were a LOT of misfires in history for #6 cylinder and quite a few for #3 as well. Also, the scan data showed the computer was commanding the MIL on. Bulb out? The interesting thing about those misfires was that #3 and #6 are on the same ignition coil. There are 3 ignition coils bolted to the ignition module and 2 cyls fire from each coil. The misfires as seen here are usually a bad ignition coil due to worn spark plugs. As I said, it doesn't seem directly related to the no-start but could very well have brought about the problem. The car has 306,000 miles. I wonder what the spark plugs look like.
Okay, the car cranks but does not start. The MIL does not come on but the engine computer is alive. When the car was last running it was misfiring on two cylinders and very likely has worn spark plugs and a bad ignition coil. Of course spark plug wires would also be part of that running problem. But the ignition problems on that side would make the car run bad, not keep it from starting.
I could hear the fuel pump run and a gauge showed good fuel pressure to the rail. So primary fuel delivery was good.
Secondary fuel delivery is the injector spray into the cylinder and I have no problem with using a noid light to check the injector signal. If it doesn't flash while cranking I'm getting no injector pulse.
I wanted to test ignition spark at the spark plug end of the plug wires, maybe even remove #3 to see just how badly these were worn. However those plug boots were stuck to the spark plugs. Not a single one was coming off without doing some damage. For the time being I ran a good wire from one coil tower over to a spark tester and no there was no spark while cranking. The items missing from a successful start are secondary ignition and injector pulse signal.
Now when I see no spark and no injector signal I start thinking there is a problem with a crankshaft position signal. Throw in that the plugs, wires and coil have problems and we could even have a bad ignition module as well. I watched the tachometer while cranking and it never moved feeding right into my hypothesis.
I decided to check my signal from the crankshaft position sensor which is behind the front crank pulley. Removing the right front tire will give pretty good access for testing purposes. The wiring was not in good shape near the connector for running the car, but those bare spots were good for connecting test leads. With the key on and turning the crankshaft by hand I should be able to see the crank signals from the sensor but there were no signals. I need voltage to the sensor from the ignition module to make the sensor work but there was no voltage from the module.
I had ignition voltage to the module but nothing from the module to the crank sensor. I had a bad ignition module. Fits right in with the way a secondary will die if you keep driving with an ignition misfire, plugs, wires, coil, module. My car won't start had become I have a bad ignition module that isn't providing voltage to my crankshaft position sensor and that my friend, is something you can work with.
On removing the old module I found there was a crack in the 1-4 coil. Two bad coils in total (of 3). One bad ignition module. Replaced spark plugs and plug wires and repaired wiring at sensor.
It's about patience and a logical plan.
Kenny@ggauto.repair
G&G Auto Repair
Searcy
A mechanic, on the other hand, isn't necessarily trying to start your car. He's trying to see why it won't start. There is a difference. There are a lot of reasons for a car to not start and there are a lot of different cars. Lets walk through this particular no-start on a 2005 Impala.
No-start has to get broken down into smaller possibilities. Does the engine crank? Cranking is the starter engaging and spinning the engine. If it cranks well, spins over well then your no-start isn't a battery, alternator or starter issue and you can forget about looking for jumper cables.
I noticed there was no check engine (MIL) light on with the key on. There should be at least a bulb check. I connected a scan tool mainly to see if the engine computer was working. The computer was communicating, several codes were stored but none seemed directly related to the no-start. There were a LOT of misfires in history for #6 cylinder and quite a few for #3 as well. Also, the scan data showed the computer was commanding the MIL on. Bulb out? The interesting thing about those misfires was that #3 and #6 are on the same ignition coil. There are 3 ignition coils bolted to the ignition module and 2 cyls fire from each coil. The misfires as seen here are usually a bad ignition coil due to worn spark plugs. As I said, it doesn't seem directly related to the no-start but could very well have brought about the problem. The car has 306,000 miles. I wonder what the spark plugs look like.
Okay, the car cranks but does not start. The MIL does not come on but the engine computer is alive. When the car was last running it was misfiring on two cylinders and very likely has worn spark plugs and a bad ignition coil. Of course spark plug wires would also be part of that running problem. But the ignition problems on that side would make the car run bad, not keep it from starting.
I could hear the fuel pump run and a gauge showed good fuel pressure to the rail. So primary fuel delivery was good.
Secondary fuel delivery is the injector spray into the cylinder and I have no problem with using a noid light to check the injector signal. If it doesn't flash while cranking I'm getting no injector pulse.
I wanted to test ignition spark at the spark plug end of the plug wires, maybe even remove #3 to see just how badly these were worn. However those plug boots were stuck to the spark plugs. Not a single one was coming off without doing some damage. For the time being I ran a good wire from one coil tower over to a spark tester and no there was no spark while cranking. The items missing from a successful start are secondary ignition and injector pulse signal.
Now when I see no spark and no injector signal I start thinking there is a problem with a crankshaft position signal. Throw in that the plugs, wires and coil have problems and we could even have a bad ignition module as well. I watched the tachometer while cranking and it never moved feeding right into my hypothesis.
I decided to check my signal from the crankshaft position sensor which is behind the front crank pulley. Removing the right front tire will give pretty good access for testing purposes. The wiring was not in good shape near the connector for running the car, but those bare spots were good for connecting test leads. With the key on and turning the crankshaft by hand I should be able to see the crank signals from the sensor but there were no signals. I need voltage to the sensor from the ignition module to make the sensor work but there was no voltage from the module.
I had ignition voltage to the module but nothing from the module to the crank sensor. I had a bad ignition module. Fits right in with the way a secondary will die if you keep driving with an ignition misfire, plugs, wires, coil, module. My car won't start had become I have a bad ignition module that isn't providing voltage to my crankshaft position sensor and that my friend, is something you can work with.
On removing the old module I found there was a crack in the 1-4 coil. Two bad coils in total (of 3). One bad ignition module. Replaced spark plugs and plug wires and repaired wiring at sensor.
Kenny@ggauto.repair
G&G Auto Repair
Searcy
Friday, January 31, 2020
2014 Nissan Altima S 2.5 Stalls At Idle
One of my good customers called with a description of stalling after a start at idle, battery light and a lot of corrosion at the battery terminals. I thought the stalling problem might be too low an idle rpm and suggested the one foot for braking and one foot for keeping it just off idle to raise the rpms. That worked well enough to get the car to the shop. When I drove the car inside there was no stalling or low rpm. In fact it ran very well but there was a check engine light. A light means a code. A code might be a clue to what had been going on.
A P0101 MAF sensor code was stored and actually is a pretty common fault code on these cars. So common in fact there is a technical service bulletin that suggests an updated PCV valve and a possible ecm flash update, depending on ecm part number. NHTSA ID: 10119177
TSB ID: NTB16-030a
A P0101 MAF sensor code was stored and actually is a pretty common fault code on these cars. So common in fact there is a technical service bulletin that suggests an updated PCV valve and a possible ecm flash update, depending on ecm part number. NHTSA ID: 10119177
TSB ID: NTB16-030a
That being said, nothing about the known P0101 problem would explain the stalling complaint. Also, the manner of driving with one foot on brake and the other on the accelerator could have set the code. In the few minutes I was with key on checking for codes the car battery voltage had lowered enough that the car powered down to save battery voltage. This brought me to what Danny (customer) had said about the battery condition. I decided to let the P0101 aside for now. I had another idea about the original complaint and its cause. I should explain that a car has a learned memory or an updated one that stores slight adjustments over time to compensate for wear or tear that has taken place since it has been getting older. If you reset the memory it goes back to before the learned behaviors and then has to relearn the adapts. One very common thing to happen over time is a buildup of carbon at the air intake throttle body and throttle plate. The buildup was slow and the idle strategy adapted to it to keep the car idling at a proper rpm. Clearing the adapts on a car that has a dirty throttle (carbon) will cause the car to stall at idle until the relearn adapts OR until you clean the carbon. If you clean the throttle the idle will not have to be relearned but will already match the reset strategy. I suggest cleaning the throttle after a reset.
The battery here had not been disconnected and the battery had not failed to crank the car. You might wonder then why am I thinking of a problem with throttle carbon buildup and memory resets. A weak battery can drop voltage low enough during a crank to reset the learned adapts. Seriously. I've seen it more on a Dodge than other models so they may be more sensitive to it. It isn't just reset either. Some codes can set on a start that were a result of battery voltage dropping too much during an engine crank. The rule of thumb here, for me anyway, is that if the voltage drops lower than 10 volts during cranking its a problem.
The plan was now to see if this battery was dropping too low on a crank and if the throttle plate was carbon dirty. Those two things and I'd have evidence this was the problem.
The battery voltage starts at the left, the drop is down to 7.84 during the crank and then once the engine starts the voltage is output of the alternator. So yes the voltage is going low enough to reset the adapts and I do need a battery. But I need to see carbon buildup on the throttle to explain the stalling.
Especially sensitive to any carbon is the edge of that throttle plate. Cleaning the throttle and replacing the battery should be the fix. At least it can't hurt.
Cranking voltage with a new battery.
The P0101. I cleared the code and after 3 trips it had not reappeared even as a pending code. I decided not to pursue further.
Thanks for reading!
Kenny@ggauto.repair
Thursday, January 30, 2020
'92 Astro Van 4.3Z (repost from 2008)
Diagnostic Tech: '92 Astro Van, 4.3Z
I had a '92 Astro Van come in on the hook for a no-start. The engine was a 4.3 with throttle body fuel injection. The owner said the van had been stalling and sometimes failing to start for some time now. He had replaced the fuel pump and filter because he though it seemed to be running out of fuel. No testing had been done and the same problem remained after the fuel pump replacement. When I turned the key on I could hear the fuel pump run. Turning the key to start engaged the starter, the engine spun nicely and .... it even started right up! It isn't uncommon for a no-start to be towed in and then start once it gets here. I'm sure there is an applicable Murphy's law for that.
What I did notice though was an intermittent engine cut-out. A sure fire sign of a secondary ignition problem. Even though the van owner was still sure he had a fuel problem, I decided to take a look at the ignition system. On the Astro Van the ignition system is easy to access once the engine cover is removed. I immediately saw what was probably causing the cut-out symptom I had noticed. There was a burn mark where the secondary spark from the coil wire had been jumping to a vacuum hose instead of following the intended path to the distributor cap. That meant the resistance in the secondary, downstream of the coil wire was so great that the spark found it easier to jump to the vacuum hose. A mental list of plugs, wires, cap and rotor was forming in my mind.
As I began the work of replacing the secondary ignition parts I began to be amazed that this engine was running at all. The coil wire tower in the cap was completely burned away.
The rotor was burned through and the distributor was severely corroded.
After a cleaning with electrical contact cleaner and penetrating oil the distributor was found to be in good condition. I replaced the spark plugs, spark plug wires, distributor cap and rotor. The van ran very well after that with no more stalling or cutting out. At 264,000 miles I wouldn't be surprised if it did need that fuel pump as well.
Kenneth Hayes
kenny@ggauto.repair
Originally posted 2008 for carfix online.
I had a '92 Astro Van come in on the hook for a no-start. The engine was a 4.3 with throttle body fuel injection. The owner said the van had been stalling and sometimes failing to start for some time now. He had replaced the fuel pump and filter because he though it seemed to be running out of fuel. No testing had been done and the same problem remained after the fuel pump replacement. When I turned the key on I could hear the fuel pump run. Turning the key to start engaged the starter, the engine spun nicely and .... it even started right up! It isn't uncommon for a no-start to be towed in and then start once it gets here. I'm sure there is an applicable Murphy's law for that.
What I did notice though was an intermittent engine cut-out. A sure fire sign of a secondary ignition problem. Even though the van owner was still sure he had a fuel problem, I decided to take a look at the ignition system. On the Astro Van the ignition system is easy to access once the engine cover is removed. I immediately saw what was probably causing the cut-out symptom I had noticed. There was a burn mark where the secondary spark from the coil wire had been jumping to a vacuum hose instead of following the intended path to the distributor cap. That meant the resistance in the secondary, downstream of the coil wire was so great that the spark found it easier to jump to the vacuum hose. A mental list of plugs, wires, cap and rotor was forming in my mind.
As I began the work of replacing the secondary ignition parts I began to be amazed that this engine was running at all. The coil wire tower in the cap was completely burned away.
The rotor was burned through and the distributor was severely corroded.
After a cleaning with electrical contact cleaner and penetrating oil the distributor was found to be in good condition. I replaced the spark plugs, spark plug wires, distributor cap and rotor. The van ran very well after that with no more stalling or cutting out. At 264,000 miles I wouldn't be surprised if it did need that fuel pump as well.
Kenneth Hayes
kenny@ggauto.repair
Originally posted 2008 for carfix online.
Tuesday, January 14, 2020
1995 Ford Checks: OBDI EECIV
1995 Ford F250 XL w/5.8 engine uses the EECIV engine control system. If you are going to use the EECIV system for self tests you need to know a bit about the system. The first thing to do is have the engine at operating temperature, better known as warmed up. Before doing so, remove the radiator cap and check the radiator is full. This particular truck was low of coolant, about a half gallon low. Pressure testing showed some slight coolant seepage at the radiator and the intake manifold. For now we will fill the radiator, start the engine and let the coolant temperature reach normal operating temperature in preparation for the self tests.
The engine is warm, the coolant level is full, the oil level is full and the battery is charged. Those are the prerequisites for tests.
Slow codes is more like counting light flashes. You can count the pulses as the code is output. Here we have 1 pulse, pause, 1 pulse, pause, 1 pulse or 1 1 1. 111 System pass. The initial single pulse before the slow code output is the fast code output signal.
Cool huh? Now that you understand KOEO testing, I'll just mention there is more to it. There are actually two parts to KOEO tests. The first part, the part that outputs live codes is called KOEO On Demand. On Demand is the live codes for faults present at the time of the test. The second part of the KOEO test is called Keep Alive and is basically memory codes stored from previous faults. Keep Alive codes are output at the end of the On Demand codes. If you were counting pulses (slow codes) you would see a single separator pulse followed by any stored Keep Alive codes.
Make note of your Keep Alive codes because they are fragile. Sometimes just ending the test will remove the code so remember it had a code in memory and in this case it was 123. Now because Ford doesn't trust us to know the details of the self tests that were performed and because we got a system pass in the on demand codes we make a reminder that we have a 123 in keep alive and move on to KOER code tests because that is the proper sequence as designed. If there were on demand codes you would diagnose and repair those first then start over with the KOEO tests.
KOER tests also require the warmed engine, charged battery and full fluids. Most scan tools will request you to run the engine 3 minutes at 2000 rpm just prior to the test. You'll need to turn off accessories like heater/air to prevent false codes. If your scan tool is worth using it will walk you through the tests because KOEO tests are more interactive than the previous. At the prompts, run the 2000 rpm event, shut off the engine, start the engine, there will be a series of beeps to identify the engine cylinder number, 4 beeps for this 8 cyl., after the cyl id press the brake and release, turn steering wheel half turn, press the cruise set switch and the overdrive switch (as applicable). Then relax for a bit. The rpms will drop very low and a few seconds later you will be asked to "goose the throttle" which is ford tech speak for punch the accelerator to the floor and release very quickly. The tests will complete and you will get results. In this case I got another 111 system pass.
So now I have passes in both KOEO On Demand and KOER tests. The truck complaint was a hunting idle rpm and a check engine light. On the way to the shop though it ran fine and the light was out. So far that is the same here even during the checks. We have the 123 code in Keep Alive and by the book that is where to go but I suspect this problem is intermittent and the code may not be helpful. 123 would be the throttle sensor signal voltage too high which apparently was not the case in KOEO On Demand or during KOER since it ran fine.
Next step then, see what the tps signal voltage is. Not all old Fords have a datastream available but this one does.
Let me quickly touch on datastream. The scan tool has tapped into some of the data available from the engine computer. The data exchange doesn't look that nicely sorted and displayed between the two computers (ecm and scan). It would look like this screen capture of the exchange.
Within that datastream is what the engine computer thinks is going on and the information is being presented to you by the scan tool in a format you can understand. Before datastreaming you had to measure signals at the engine computer connector. You have to bear in mind when looking at scan data that it isn't necessarily the actual sensor signal present at the connector. For that you'd need to verify with a meter at the connector. What the scan data strength is sometimes though is that you are looking at what the computer sees going on, right or wrong. That insight can be helpful because you won't measure it, you have to see it in the scan data.
It can be hard to reach the computer connector, use a meter and properly identify the pins. Here is a Ford *breakout box* to help in that task. Connect the box between the ecm and ecm connector then use the box to access pin circuits.
If you saw my post on quora about reading GM codes with a paper clip well you can also do that with a Ford however it is more complicated because it triggers the Ford self tests which as you have seen are more than just code flashes. You need a wire paper clip. No voltmeter or jumper or scan tool. Bend the paper clip into a U shape and use it to connect the STI and Signal Return.
Now when you start your KOEO self tests you'll be watching the check engine light flashes instead of pulses or needle sweeps.
Hope you find that interesting or at least informative! Back to the Ford truck problem though. I haven't seen the truck do anything wrong and the throttle position sensor output is fine. I'm not out of options quite yet.
Ford has more tests available so there is a bit of wiggle room.
Sorry.
Wiggle test state lets you shake, pull and tug on wire harness and connectors while the system monitors voltages for change. Nothing found though. A few more test drives and still nothing. I may have to let this one go with no fix at this time. But didn't we have fun?!
Thanks for reading!
kenny@ggauto.repair
Ford self-tests on this system start with KOEO, key on engine off tests. Trigger the test and the truck runs a series of pre-programmed tests and outputs the results. Other than your beginning the sequence and listening to the noises as the tests proceed you are just an observer. Think about it though. KOEO codes/results are LIVE. Any results are for the current time and the current tests.
Let's run through a KOEO test. The diagnostic connector is at the fender, under the hood and I do have a compatible scan tool.
What are fast codes? If you run KOEO in fast codes you won't see the code output. The scan tool will capture the codes and place them in the "review codes" section for your later perusal.
Slow codes is more like counting light flashes. You can count the pulses as the code is output. Here we have 1 pulse, pause, 1 pulse, pause, 1 pulse or 1 1 1. 111 System pass. The initial single pulse before the slow code output is the fast code output signal.
Cool huh? Now that you understand KOEO testing, I'll just mention there is more to it. There are actually two parts to KOEO tests. The first part, the part that outputs live codes is called KOEO On Demand. On Demand is the live codes for faults present at the time of the test. The second part of the KOEO test is called Keep Alive and is basically memory codes stored from previous faults. Keep Alive codes are output at the end of the On Demand codes. If you were counting pulses (slow codes) you would see a single separator pulse followed by any stored Keep Alive codes.
Make note of your Keep Alive codes because they are fragile. Sometimes just ending the test will remove the code so remember it had a code in memory and in this case it was 123. Now because Ford doesn't trust us to know the details of the self tests that were performed and because we got a system pass in the on demand codes we make a reminder that we have a 123 in keep alive and move on to KOER code tests because that is the proper sequence as designed. If there were on demand codes you would diagnose and repair those first then start over with the KOEO tests.
KOER tests also require the warmed engine, charged battery and full fluids. Most scan tools will request you to run the engine 3 minutes at 2000 rpm just prior to the test. You'll need to turn off accessories like heater/air to prevent false codes. If your scan tool is worth using it will walk you through the tests because KOEO tests are more interactive than the previous. At the prompts, run the 2000 rpm event, shut off the engine, start the engine, there will be a series of beeps to identify the engine cylinder number, 4 beeps for this 8 cyl., after the cyl id press the brake and release, turn steering wheel half turn, press the cruise set switch and the overdrive switch (as applicable). Then relax for a bit. The rpms will drop very low and a few seconds later you will be asked to "goose the throttle" which is ford tech speak for punch the accelerator to the floor and release very quickly. The tests will complete and you will get results. In this case I got another 111 system pass.
So now I have passes in both KOEO On Demand and KOER tests. The truck complaint was a hunting idle rpm and a check engine light. On the way to the shop though it ran fine and the light was out. So far that is the same here even during the checks. We have the 123 code in Keep Alive and by the book that is where to go but I suspect this problem is intermittent and the code may not be helpful. 123 would be the throttle sensor signal voltage too high which apparently was not the case in KOEO On Demand or during KOER since it ran fine.
Next step then, see what the tps signal voltage is. Not all old Fords have a datastream available but this one does.
Let me quickly touch on datastream. The scan tool has tapped into some of the data available from the engine computer. The data exchange doesn't look that nicely sorted and displayed between the two computers (ecm and scan). It would look like this screen capture of the exchange.
Within that datastream is what the engine computer thinks is going on and the information is being presented to you by the scan tool in a format you can understand. Before datastreaming you had to measure signals at the engine computer connector. You have to bear in mind when looking at scan data that it isn't necessarily the actual sensor signal present at the connector. For that you'd need to verify with a meter at the connector. What the scan data strength is sometimes though is that you are looking at what the computer sees going on, right or wrong. That insight can be helpful because you won't measure it, you have to see it in the scan data.
It can be hard to reach the computer connector, use a meter and properly identify the pins. Here is a Ford *breakout box* to help in that task. Connect the box between the ecm and ecm connector then use the box to access pin circuits.
Now, you won't see scan data without a scan tool but you can measure pin voltages at the ecm with a meter. You can also run Ford self tests without a scan tool. You can use a voltmeter. Remember all those pulses during the scan tool code tests? Works the same way with a voltmeter but you'll need to know what the pulses mean when the needle sweeps. Hook the positive lead of your voltmeter to the positive battery terminal. Hook your negative lead to the STO terminal of the diagnostic connector. Use a jumper wire to connect the STI terminal to the Signal Return terminal.
When you turn the key on the KOEO test will start and the pulses will become needle sweeps. The first needle jump will be the fast codes, followed by (in this case) sweep, sweep, sweep. 1 1 1 or the 111 pass. Two 111 code sweeps followed by the separator sweep and the KOEO Keep Alive codes. You can even run the KOER tests. As I said though you'll need to know what is expected of you during the tests. Still, very neat. Here's the initial KOEO sweep, fast codes followed by 111.
If you saw my post on quora about reading GM codes with a paper clip well you can also do that with a Ford however it is more complicated because it triggers the Ford self tests which as you have seen are more than just code flashes. You need a wire paper clip. No voltmeter or jumper or scan tool. Bend the paper clip into a U shape and use it to connect the STI and Signal Return.
Now when you start your KOEO self tests you'll be watching the check engine light flashes instead of pulses or needle sweeps.
Hope you find that interesting or at least informative! Back to the Ford truck problem though. I haven't seen the truck do anything wrong and the throttle position sensor output is fine. I'm not out of options quite yet.
Ford has more tests available so there is a bit of wiggle room.
Sorry.
Wiggle test state lets you shake, pull and tug on wire harness and connectors while the system monitors voltages for change. Nothing found though. A few more test drives and still nothing. I may have to let this one go with no fix at this time. But didn't we have fun?!
Thanks for reading!
kenny@ggauto.repair
Friday, December 20, 2019
When your brake pedal sinks.
2001 Saturn SL1 : Brake pedal sinks complaint.
I found the brake pedal going to second stage and not sinking from there. Usually this is a hydraulic problem so you want to check the fluid level. If the reservoir is full, it may be an internal master cylinder problem. If the fluid level is low you may have a leak in the system.
The reservoir is empty but the area around the master cylinder is dry. We need to inspect the brake hydraulic system and look for where this fluid went.
We're looking for a wet spot. A leak at one of the wheels will usually show up on the inside of the tire.
In this case, right rear wheel.
This car has drum brakes in the rear and the fluid is coming from inside the drum so the leak will be a wheel cylinder.
The shoes have a lot of pad material but it is saturated with fluid. We'll need new rear shoes and wheel cylinders. The drum is in good shape so we'll clean and reuse. If we try to reuse the brake shoes after this fluid saturation they will tend to grab and not apply smoothly. The other rear wheel, which has dry shoes will apply differently as they no longer match. Brake shoes come in a set, replace as a set. The wheel cylinder on the left rear doesn't appear to be leaking but is the same age and conditions as the one on the right. If it isn't leaking now, it will soon be.
Now, this left side looks okay but we'll be replacing it and the shoes for the reasons I've said. I wanted to show you something else though while I'm here. Because there is no fluid visible on the outside of this wheel cylinder does not mean it isn't leaking. The leak has to get past those outer boots before it is visible. So peel the boot back and look for signs of wetness. If there is fluid inside the boot, the cylinder is bad.
Both wheel cylinders, all brake shoes, clean drums. Not finished inspecting yet either. Just as you don't want to do one wheel when both need service, you don't want to do only rear when front need service so we'll be inspecting the front brakes as well.
Pull both front wheels and inspect front disc brake pads, both inside and outside pad. No problems here.
Okay. Lets get some parts and fix these rear brakes!
Thanks!
Kenneth Hayes
khayes@ggauto.repair
I found the brake pedal going to second stage and not sinking from there. Usually this is a hydraulic problem so you want to check the fluid level. If the reservoir is full, it may be an internal master cylinder problem. If the fluid level is low you may have a leak in the system.
The reservoir is empty but the area around the master cylinder is dry. We need to inspect the brake hydraulic system and look for where this fluid went.
We're looking for a wet spot. A leak at one of the wheels will usually show up on the inside of the tire.
In this case, right rear wheel.
This car has drum brakes in the rear and the fluid is coming from inside the drum so the leak will be a wheel cylinder.
The shoes have a lot of pad material but it is saturated with fluid. We'll need new rear shoes and wheel cylinders. The drum is in good shape so we'll clean and reuse. If we try to reuse the brake shoes after this fluid saturation they will tend to grab and not apply smoothly. The other rear wheel, which has dry shoes will apply differently as they no longer match. Brake shoes come in a set, replace as a set. The wheel cylinder on the left rear doesn't appear to be leaking but is the same age and conditions as the one on the right. If it isn't leaking now, it will soon be.
Now, this left side looks okay but we'll be replacing it and the shoes for the reasons I've said. I wanted to show you something else though while I'm here. Because there is no fluid visible on the outside of this wheel cylinder does not mean it isn't leaking. The leak has to get past those outer boots before it is visible. So peel the boot back and look for signs of wetness. If there is fluid inside the boot, the cylinder is bad.
Both wheel cylinders, all brake shoes, clean drums. Not finished inspecting yet either. Just as you don't want to do one wheel when both need service, you don't want to do only rear when front need service so we'll be inspecting the front brakes as well.
Pull both front wheels and inspect front disc brake pads, both inside and outside pad. No problems here.
Okay. Lets get some parts and fix these rear brakes!
Thanks!
Kenneth Hayes
khayes@ggauto.repair
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